brethren, maybe this will resolve all perfect debates "is perfect" vs "was perfect" was perfect: adam, lucifer , Noah , job , Asa is perfect: moses, Elijah , enoch how to be perfect? by grace thru faith , repentance . when to be perfect? between now and close of probation ( personal close of probation) do you know you're perfect? egw says cannot claim & cannot know ( struggling but not sinning ) until 2nd coming. perfection can be lost (via sin). perfection can / should be (re) gained ( repentance , grace, faith...) Jesus is perfect, was perfect, has always been Lucifer was perfect, could have become perfect again if he repented/repents but will never because of pride (of accepting he was wrong). We can be perfect by God's grace thru faith, not of ourselves it is the gift of God coz our works don't count to salvation as we were supposed to do good anyway all the time . if we commit sin (losing perfection), repentance puts us perfect wit